Spectrum | Feb. 16 8:20 pm EST
rotc

USenate releases ROTC poll

The USenate has released its poll on ROTC’s presence on campus. This poll, which you can vote in here, is one of a series of moves the USenate Task Force has made to gauge student interest in ROTC. The poll contains seven multiple-choice questions on ROTC and asks for your school affiliation. Voting ends Feb. 24, 11:59 p.m. Full email from the USenate Task Force Co-Chairs Ron Mazor and Roosevelt Montas after the jump.

Dear Students of Barnard College, Columbia College, General Studies, SEAS, and SIPA:

The University Senate Task Force on Military Engagement is conducting a survey of student opinion in your schools on the question of whether Columbia should expand its relationship with the U.S. Armed Forces by participating more actively in programs of the Reserve Officers Training Corps (ROTC).

Your five schools were selected for participation in the survey because students from each have participated as cadets in off-campus ROTC programs in the past five years.

The survey begins today, February 16, at 8 pm, and ends at 11:59 pm on February 24. The results will inform the deliberations of the Task Force in preparing its report to the Senate on March 4. The Senate will also consider these results carefully in its discussions of ROTC, which may culminate in a vote before the end of the spring semester.

Please feel free before completing the survey to consult the Task Force website on ROTC (http://www.columbia.edu/cu/senate/militaryengagement/), which includes historical material, a transcript of the Task Force hearing of February 7, and a collection of recent email submissions from members of the Columbia community.

The survey should take only a few minutes. Go to the portal at , supply your UNI and password, and answer eight questions. The survey includes security features to assure the anonymity of your response and to prevent multiple responses.

Thanks for your participation!

Ron Mazor
Co-Chair, Task Force on Military Engagement
CC ’09, Law ’12

Roosevelt Montas
Co-Chair, Task Force on Military Engagement
Associate Dean, Center for the Core Curriculum
CC ’95, GSAS ’96, GSAS ’04

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COMMENTS (22)

  1. David Dethrow (dethcorp) • February 21, 2011 at 11:17 am • Reply

    There can be no peace if any ROTC or armed forces are allowed to brainwash students or our young ones. What a concept, eliminate all religion and armies and no one picks up a gun. Catholics kill Catholics, Protestants kill Protestants…and so on and so on…based on their politics, nationalism and hypocritical thinking.

    NOTE! Any “so-called” Christian on campus that supports ANY armed forces is a hypocrite and false to their own alleged guidebook. Please see Isaiah 2:2-4,and John 6:15 which states “Jesus, knowing they were about to come and seize him to make him king, withdrew again into the mountain all alone.” Jesus’ stand could hardly have been more decisive. He resolutely refused to get involved in the politics of his homeland. His stand never changed. He said that his true followers were to take the same position. (John 17:16) It’s so funny that Christians don’t read and apply their own book!

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    • Anonymous • February 21, 2011 at 2:24 pm • Reply

      Your Pathetic!

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    • Todd • February 26, 2011 at 9:01 pm • Reply

      I second that you are PATHETIC. Go live in Iraq and try to have freedom of speech. It is our freedom fights who have died for your freedom allowing you to say this about them.

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  2. Larry LeBlanc • February 21, 2011 at 2:18 pm • Reply

    David – Read your position and understand it with respect, Unfortunately
    the treatment of Anthony Maschek was indefensible It cancels out your moral authority and makes you hypocrite. Your premise was sound but the attack on Anthony Maschek’s personhood does not
    work in your favor. How can you garner support with these actions ?

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  3. CLS Student • February 21, 2011 at 2:37 pm • Reply

    Why is the law school not being surveyed?

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  4. eva lynn • February 21, 2011 at 3:05 pm • Reply

    I feel so sick to hear how supposed American students treated this vet. What kind of snot nose people are you? Maybe you should change countries. I feel even more discusted with the teachers.

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  5. studenthere • February 21, 2011 at 5:02 pm • Reply

    Since when did “educated” become snot-nosed, elitist, or spoiled? Here at Columbia, a large majority of students oppose ROTC because it is discriminatory to transgendered people, women, and the lower socioeconomic classes. Are we so snotty because we are looking out for those who do not understand the full implications of joining the military? We spend our time here searching for alternative solutions to peace. If other schools want to promote an institution that will send their students off to die, that is their decision. Columbia graduates are better suited to create real solutions to the world’s problems. If the whole world were Columbia educated, it would be a much better place. If the whole world were ROTC educated, we would all fear for our lives. Discrimination, rape, and bigotry are rampant in the military. It is embarrassing. Additionally, I believe all humans, including Anthony Maschek, should be treated with respect, but you cannot ask us to support the actions of a soldier when we do not agree with the wars they are fighting. No matter how many times someone is shot, they are not truly defending my ideals.

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    • Alice • February 21, 2011 at 10:17 pm • Reply

      No matter what your view of the ROTC, your hypocrisy,arrogance and ignorance only proves your stupidity. Your disrespect for someone in a wheelchair and bad manners should make me feel sorry for you and the poor job your parents did raising you. Shut your mouth over something you know nothing about. Please leave this country and never return. You are what is wrong with this country..

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  6. Brett • February 21, 2011 at 5:02 pm • Reply

    Dethcorp, you are certainly entitled to your own opinions but I think you paint with a very broad brush.

    For one, you oversimplify the actions of Jesus as he was arrested by the authorities. Space will prevent a full exploration of the subject but 1) Jesus knew he was to die and for that to happen had to submit to the authorities 2) Jesus was clearly not absolutely opposed to violence as he scourged the moneychangers from the Temple. To extrapolate that Jesus opposed war (or the military) in every situation is absurd and counter to the biblical record. The refusal of the Christ to involve himself in the political affairs of his homeland is deeply rooted in the type of kingdom he was claiming and the nature of his messianic legacy.

    The key to reading the Bible is to read it with an open mind rather than merely as a means of justifying one’s beliefs by a few disparate passages taken out of context.

    Additionally, neither ROTC nor the military brainwashes civilians and they have no means to do as given that our military is a volunteer force. Neither does the military brainwash its personnel although the armed forces do break down the social, moral, and spiritual barriers that prevent a soldier from taking a human life. Yet they training is not designed nor intended to make men and women into stone cold killers but rather to shape people who value the lives of non-combatants as well as their peers taking lives ONLY in their pursuit of defending our nation from the aggressions of others who wish us harm.

    Have men and women of the American armed forces done some horrible things? A few have but the terrible nature of their conduct is not representative of the honorable service the vast majority of our service people render. Far more heinous crimes and in much greater numbers are committed daily by civilians.

    Fortunately for dethcorp and the rest of the paranoid liberal Left, the armed forced of the United States stand at the door keeping the rabid wolves of Islamofascism and other threats to our way of life at bay. God bless each and every one who dons a uniform of the United States military.

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  7. Brett • February 21, 2011 at 6:23 pm • Reply

    studenthere, your compassion for the transgendered, women and the poor do you credit but your lack of compassion for those who protect our nation is discouraging.

    Columbia is a fine school but there are others just as well considered. Nor is an Ivy League education the mark of distinction that sets its graduates as better than other hard working citizens of this nation. Indeed, a college education from any university is no replacement for experience acquired by age and time. It is clear you have but the sketchiest grasp of the military, its role, and the people who serve in its ranks. Perhaps in time that will change but only if Columbia inculcates within you an open mind rather than political indoctrination.

    Peace is always to be preferred over war but we don’t always get the choice we prefer. For example, World War Two might have been avoidable had Britain and France been more aggressive in dealing with Germany between 1938 and 1940. President Lincoln could hardly have kept the Union intact without the bloody mess of the Civil War. Despite all of our wishes, war is as old as man and cannot be altogether eliminated because the seeds of conflict reside in every man. Until ambition, fear and self-interest is eradicated from the human heart and mind, the observations of Thucydides will ring true.

    Whether the world would be a better place if every person was a Columbia graduate is debatable. Just as many wars have been started by liberals seeking to change the world as have been initiated by conservatives. The two sides merely measure the benefits of their actions by different standards designed to bolster the agendas.

    Neither is every person cut out to be a military officer although few people would not benefit from the discipline and esprit de corps learned by a year or two of compulsory service. Yet our nation has been well served by the volunteer military for the people under arms are there by their own choice and commitment making their service that much deeper than many other walks of life.

    “Discrimination, rape, and bigotry” are far less common that you surmise and I will argue that rape is far more prevalent on college campuses than any military post. The charge of discrimination is ludicrous because the military has long been recognized as a primary avenue of social and economic advancement by the disadvantaged. And bigotry is nor more nor less present than in any other community (and that includes Columbia, Yale, Texas, and San Jose State).

    Enjoy the freedom granted to you to study at Columbia, to define your life with altruistic dreams, and to pursue your own dreams. That freedom was guaranteed by the blood of Maschek and a host of other men and women, living and now deceased, who have worn the uniforms of the United States military at home and abroad, in peace and in war. Swearing to defend “defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic” and by extension the people that comprise the land founded upon that same Constitution, the men and women of the military have given their bodies, their minds, and their lives in service to a nation that does not always appreciate their sacrifices.

    As Kipling wrote in his poem “Tommy;”

    Yes, makin’ mock o’ uniforms that guard you while you sleep
    Is cheaper than them uniforms, an’ they’re starvation cheap;
    An’ hustlin’ drunken soldiers when they’re goin’ large a bit
    Is five times better business than paradin’ in full kit.
    Then it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ “Tommy, ‘ow’s yer soul?”
    But it’s “Thin red line of ‘eroes” when the drums begin to roll,
    The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
    O it’s “Thin red line of ‘eroes” when the drums begin to roll.

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  8. Jose • February 21, 2011 at 6:36 pm • Reply

    Studenthere, if you and those of your ilk are the solution, then we really have a problem. The statements made by you show you to be young, stupid and uninformed. When you grow up you’ll find that discrimination, rape, and bigotry are part of your society and ROTC had nothing to do with it. Got a problem with the war/s, take it up with your representatives, not with the soldiers who in your educated opinion, do not understand the full implications of joining the military. May you grow up to be as noble as Anthony Maschek…Brett, You had me with every word and point you were making. I could tell you have “some” experience with the military world and then you brought out your paint brush and right wing labels. Sign me Left wing, 20 year veteran with a carry permit!

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  9. Anonymous • February 21, 2011 at 6:49 pm • Reply

    Beyond comment. If this now Columbia University what can one say?

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  10. Brett • February 21, 2011 at 7:10 pm • Reply

    LOL, Jose! I have no problem with liberals. I think I am the only conservative in my family! That said, while there are no doubt some conservatives who entertain some unfavorable impressions about the military, I think few would deny that such a trend is more common to the Left than the Right (who are probably more guilty of exalting the military to the exclusion of other other priorities).

    I did spend a little time in the military as an infantry officer in the Army and I have two liberal leaning brothers in the Navy who graduated from Annapolis.

    Anyway, thank you for your service to our nation.

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  11. chicagotist • February 21, 2011 at 7:14 pm • Reply

    “Compassion for the military”? Those who served are allowed at Columbia. If I am not mistaken there is even a program through which they attend the University. Sure, the guy should not have been jeered, but his comment was misinformed – he did not understand how allowing ROTC on campus goes against Columbia’s non-discrimination policy. I feel bad for him on both accounts – that he did not understand that Columbia does not let orgs and companies that discriminate easy access to students (apparently a common problem for ROTC supporters) and that he was booed.

    Now, we have to wait to see what Columbia will decide.

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  12. Brett • February 21, 2011 at 7:39 pm • Reply

    Whether to allow ROTC on the Columbia campus or not is a separate issue. I was taking dethcorp to task for his assertions that soldiers are brainwashed and his inference that they are nothing but baby killers and fascists.

    I think most of the people raising the issue of discrimination by the military and the Columbia policy on such a matter are assuming discrimination is always blatant. Discrimination per se can cut in either direction and there are many government programs that discriminate against somebody if only as a means to restrict access to the program. The fact is every school discriminates at some level if only by their admissions policies.

    Has the military discriminated against individuals in the past? Indeed. Does it still do so? Yes, in someways that is the case. Yet the military has organizationally done more to further the cause of equality in America than any other institution and that includes colleges and universities such as Columbia. It did so through the imparting of skill sets, financial compensation, and the GI Bill which has enabled many minorities to avail themselves of higher education.

    Allow ROTC on campus or not but do so based on whether such a program is consistent with the image the college has of itself. The discrimination claim is, when looked at broadly and then in detail, not compelling and arguably outright misleading. It certainly fails to grasp any concept of military discipline or uniformity

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  13. Bob R. • February 22, 2011 at 8:01 am • Reply

    It seems like there are a lot of kids at Columbia that have forgotten what happened a few miles south on 9/11.

    Our military is there to help insure that this type of thing will not happen again and when a man from the military attempts to describe what he knows and the kids have yet to understand, he should be given a whole lot more respect. Education comes in many forms.

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  14. Natt Damos • February 22, 2011 at 8:35 am • Reply

    It’s so easy to blame the military for all the bad. What about all the good?

    They stopped mass murder by Milosevic, mass rape and murder after the Haiti Quake, after WWI they built an AirBridge to get food to those in Germany, b/c the USSR was letting its people suffer.

    Everyone has their reasons for joining the military, but it is their CHOICE. If anything Columbia should at least allow people to choose, b/c that’s what it boils down to a choice. It doesnt matter how you feel about the war. It’s not your life.

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  15. anonymous student • February 22, 2011 at 12:21 pm • Reply

    I am so upset at the way students treated Anthony Maschek and am frankly embarrassed that students at an institution like Columbia, that is dedicated to education and equality, could be so naive and disrespectful

    Being both a student and an employee at Columbia, I would like to say, not all of us feel the same way and it is really sad that a few disrespectful students could create such a negative image of the school and its student body. Soldiers are people too. Just because they have chosen to serve the country it does not automatically mean that they believe in war or discriminate against people based on their sexual preferences. These are over-generalizations of a group of people who have chosen to serve our country, for whatever reason. They should be respected and honored for their service, not heckled! The bottom line is, it is true that there is a war going on and that, whether we agree or disagree with this specific war or any war in general, there are people out there who want to hurt us. Some of us have had the privilege of being displaced from this reality, but having lived in NY during 9/11, I’m SURE of the fact that there are people who would go out of their way to hurt us. The empty hole in the NYC skyline is proof of that. Yes, it was almost 10 years ago, but if you just take 1 hour to go downtown (just take the 1 from 116th) you can see for yourself the hole it has left in our city, a hole that till this day (almost 10 years from the attack) is still there.

    Whether war and/or violence is the right way to deal with this type of issue is not the decision of any individual soldier who joins the military. Rather, it is the leaders of this nation who have the power to decide what to do to protect our country. From my experience here, Columbia is an institution that educates leaders. It educates leaders in business, law, politics, sciences, etc. and if anything, allowing ROTC on campus would extend this education to soon-to-be military officers who may someday be in a position to make the right decisions for our military and our country.

    I hope that Columbia and its students can come to a respectful decision about this.

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  16. Natt Damos • February 22, 2011 at 2:32 pm • Reply

    Well said anonymous, well said

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  17. in the middle • February 26, 2011 at 9:46 am • Reply

    I guess the best and the brightest are too educated to listen.

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  18. Carol • February 27, 2011 at 12:24 pm • Reply

    And to think our men and women in the military are fighting and many times giving their lives to protect these idiot’s right and freedom of speech. David, you don’t like it? Go back home. Support the country in which you live. We need to stand up and take a stance against people like you. It took much courage for Maschek to stand at the podium in front of everyone, knowing he was going to be met with hecklers. You hecklers hide behind your signs.. Cowards.all of you. Ypu are an embarassement to this country. AMERICA, LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT!

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  19. James Alcasid • March 1, 2011 at 7:06 am • Reply

    What a shame that a few students are responsible for tarnishing Columbia’s reputation. I can understand a passionate open debate but there is no place for heckling a veteran like this.

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